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| KYB-Ultra Shock Absorber review; Wish to know more.....then get in here | |
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| Topic Started: May 17 2006, 08:41 AM (12,186 Views) | |
| sky | May 17 2006, 08:41 AM Post #1 |
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QUaLITY SINsIE
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There should be a 4th combination, someone is Penang will try this. 4) Original Spring + MB Pad with KYB Ultra 3rd combination had tested by Sifu Ken8368 yesterday. :thumbup He gave 80% improvement compare to MB Pad at 60%. He gave 80% for BMW spring also if I'm not mistaken. Meaning that, fitting this KYB Ultra alone could achieve similar results as BMW spring in terms of bounciness reduce. It seems that I have 3 combination to try, 2,3 and 4. Walao, must learn how to DIY to change Spring from Bro SF Blue. To save that RM15 X 3 or more changes... |
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| markerman | May 17 2006, 01:31 PM Post #2 |
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Helper
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Ya loh, kena “kau kau” yesterday :poison :poison :yipee :yipee I purposely to drive through all the strange bump at Puchong area, what my my doubt is …… am I driving a Wira (my previous car)??? :unsure: :wow the bounciness at the rear is totally gone, so sweat and so smooth :sweat :thumbup :clap we have 4 adults and 2 children, actual load should be ~ 6 adults(u know what I means). Ha Ha !!! :lol: :lol: :lol3: :lol3: Guys, what are u waiting for, this is a great deal, for me I feel that it is worth to spend if you are looking for a low budget solution of Avanza bounciness problem, even our cikgu already comments that it work very well with the original spring, we are not "Kia Su" people but remember one cantonese quote " sou chow ko hau mou ting tak" our worries is more on how many spare we need to keep as we may not getting this great deal in future….. :rubeyes: :rubeyes: Special thanks for those who had involve directly or indirectly in this GP deal. :TQ :tqvm :TQ :tqvm here's the order update list: GP Name list for Front 1. wongsifu (KL) 2. alxdacrow (KL) 3. 4. Edvanza (KL) 5. Boon (KL) 6. Wills888 (KL) GP Name list for Rear 1. alxdacrow (KL) 2. Wills888 (KL) 3. Jeffrey (KL) 4. Edvanza (KL) 5. wongfeihung(KL) 6. punisher (KCH) 7. Boon (KL) 8. markerman (KL) p/s: Pls dun compare this with TITAN as the TITAN is on higher range and more on individual expectation, we should treat this as low budget solution for Avanza bounciness problem. |
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| wongfeihung | May 18 2006, 02:05 PM Post #3 |
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Sei Loh Chai
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After using for few days, it gets even more comfortable. :thumbup :thumbup :sing :sing :sing. Talking about guk2 sound from abs, I dont think any members have encounter more experience than me, and with this KYB no sound at all for me, and performance wise, I dont think it is very far from GAB because I feel it is almost as good as Hotbits. Unless you want to use your Avanza for racing then better use something else, this KYB is good for all rounder- comfort plus performance. :D |
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| wongfeihung | May 18 2006, 05:13 PM Post #4 |
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Sei Loh Chai
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One of the member that fixed the KYB told me that last night one Perdana trying to disturb him on the highway and although he lost to him on the straight road but over took him on a S corner. :clap :thumbup Our Avanza now is behaving better than a saloon car now on handling. :) :)) |
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| alvin | May 21 2006, 09:09 AM Post #5 |
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S i n S i e B a b e
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My KYB. After going back and forth with MB pad. I finaly found my individual taste of KYB rear abs setup. Finaly I am in control of my car. Previously I have to adjust my driving according to the car's inadequacy weaknesses. Now I dont feel the rolling or swaying eventhough I take sharp corners with high speed producing screeching tyre sound...like doing a 90° at 80km/hr. I don't like the feeling of a car rocking sideways...just like a small boat motionless at sea ..rocking sideways by the waves. I hate the seasickness feeling that we have in a virgin avanza. I am settle down with this setup and it may not suit your taste but just for sharing. Auto Avanza wheels - original rim & tyres Air pressure - Front 215 Rear 225 Spring - Original + MB pad at rear Abs - Front Macpherson, Rear KYB Ultra.... :D |
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| alvin | May 22 2006, 09:06 AM Post #6 |
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S i n S i e B a b e
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Bro Sky, At first I was also not sure what I like so therefore I had to switch from pad to no pad and back to pad to get the best suitable to my body senses. Ken8368 was without pad and claim the feeling more like with ori abs + bmw 320 spring. But I would say KYB+ori spring is a little bit more better than that. Ori spring+MB pad = 60% = 1½ to 2½ bounce on bump = failed wavy road Ori Abs+bmw 320i spring = 70% = 1½ to 2½ bounce on bump = failed wavy road KYB+ori spring = 80% = 1½ to 2 bounce on bump = better on wavy road but recuperate too slow KYB+ori spring+MB pad = 90% = 1 bounce on bump = recuperate faster on wavy road Bouncy + rocking, body roll + swaying are almost taken care off to my expectation. All in all, you have to try it in order to know what your body senses can adapt to. Hope my 2cents opinion may help your selection... :D p.s. Air pressure plays an important role to get the best result and differs with every setup. KYB is softer after run in. |
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| Boon | May 22 2006, 03:03 PM Post #7 |
I See U
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Here it goes for my review on KYB Ultra Shock Absober. Setup Combination : KYB Ultra + BMW 320E36 Spring VS Original Stock + Spring + MB pad. [size=11]Bounciness: All gone.[/size] Testing on Road Surface type. Croosing Pot holes: Effect on hitting pot holes are reduce about 80%. Un-even road: Body roll reduce about 80%. Comfort Ranking: 9 out of 10.Posted Image Performance Satisfaction: 100% Posted Image Supportive Facts: Following behine a saloon car (not to mention which model, local model) :P I can see the car rear was bumpy with up n down jumping there.. :lol3 But when I ask my wife (sitting at second row) do she feel any bumpy at back there? She said not so. Just little.. :thumbup So What I can comment Is [size=10]TOTALLY WORTH[/size] on what u pay for it. :clap :peace :)) :)Posted Image |
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| kb | May 22 2006, 03:57 PM Post #8 |
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ThE AppRenticE
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With BM spring and KYB abs, u can say bye bye to the bounciness and welcome the comfortness :P :sleepy !!! and guess what?? now i feel the front is more bouncy compare to rear, and front KYB abs is a MUST to balance up back the whole mechanism as advise by all the sifus :thumbup ... with the full set up, u will definitely feel the differences and comfort when driving avanza :peace :D :)) :) :thumbup btw, big thanks to bro BUDI for his recomendation... :tqvm :thumbup :peace |
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| KEN8368 | May 22 2006, 11:18 PM Post #9 |
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Cikgu
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This is what I had been tested ( either my car or test drive other members car ) 1. Original spring + original abs = 30 % No comment about this setup, every body should know it :rubeyes: 2. Original spring + original abs + MB pads = 60 % pro : The rear side bounciness reduce, no bumping, the height at the rear side remain, a cheap solution. :sorry con : Only reduce the soft stage, the reduce of bounciness still can be improve. B) 3. BMW E36 spring + original abs = 80 % pro : The rear side bounciness reduce ( better than the MB pads setup ), no bumping, not very costly. :) con : The height of the rear side lowered around 1.5 ", must lower front spring also, the tyre will hit the fender if the tyre width is 195 series and above, may be must add pan hard rod also. Too many things to do. :bloodyhot 4. Original spring + KYB abs = 80 % pro : The rear side bounciness reduce, no bumping, the height ot the rear side remain, not very costly. :) con : The reduce of bounciness still can be improve, felt front side bounciness now. :unsure: 5. Sifu Ocmax's setup ( Titan, BMW spring....) = 95 % pro : Nearly perfect, already like a saloon car =) con : Too costly :bloodyhot :bloodyhot For me, I used the setup 2 while waiting for the KYB rear abs. Then spare the pair of MB pads and changed to setup 4 when I got the KYB rear abs. Now I'm planning to try the KYB front abs :D About the improvement of stability and anti roll, I can't comment here because my car already fixed the URSB and URARB, so let other members who didn't fix these bars to comment about it :ph43r: |
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| vulcan | May 24 2006, 10:49 AM Post #10 |
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my setup for rear is ori spring plus kyb rear. no mb pad. satisfaction:80%. bounciness improve. this is very obvious when you going thru' bump at normal speed(25-30km/h). noticed that it only rebound 1x and back to normal position compared to mb pad under same condition about 3x. so don't hv to worry much about road condition nowaday except BIG potholes. tq for those helping in getting the kyb. those sat in my avanza for testing will experienced that. |
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| thomasllp62 | May 29 2006, 12:37 AM Post #11 |
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FOrUM
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Check on the force use to depress the original and the Gab abs that i have with a weighing machine. The ori needs 13 kg of force to depress ,the Gab 20 kg and the KYB Ultra SP8439 16 kg just what we were wishing for. The travel time from fully depressed to maximum is a surprise 7 seconds for GAB and 11.5 sec.for ori. KYB ultra, 8.5 sec. Posted Image Posted Image |
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| kiatkiat | May 29 2006, 09:09 AM Post #12 |
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I'm Hello Kitty
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THANKS ALL BRO AFTER I INSTALL THE KYB , NOW NOT BOUNCE AREALY ! :) :) :) EVEN SITTING 5 PERSON IS OSO NOT HIT THE BUMP STOP AGAIN :iloveu :iloveu :iloveu ! I MEANS IS ORIGINAL BUMP STOP ! MY SETTING IS BMW 320 SPRING WITH KYB & ARB ! I CAN SAY IS PERFECT ! :iloveu2 :iloveu2 :iloveu2 I WON'T CHANGE ANYTHING AGAIN ! THANKS ALL THE SIFU !!! :peace :peace :peace |
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| sky | May 29 2006, 05:22 PM Post #13 |
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QUaLITY SINsIE
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My review after installed for 7 days. I ever tried the following combination before: 1. Ori. Abs + BMW Spring - Good handling and comfort but feel quite stiff sometime, unable to carry 5 adults and above for long distance. Body Roll/Sway is there. Need to lower front too to match this since it's lower than Original setup. 2. Ori. Abs + DR spring - Good handling after lowerred, soft comfort. But too soft creates pretty bad Body Roll/Sway. BMW Spring is higher and better than this. 3. Ori. Abs + Ori. Spring + MB Pad - More comfort than above 2 setup, less stiffer than BMW spring. But increase height for about 10mm. Only work with less than 3-4 adults load in reducing the boucyness, still bouncy if with 5 and above adults loaded. 4. KYB Ultra + Ori. Spring + MB Pad (Current) - The world just got better! You will feel like to make the front work like this rear combination too. It reduced 80% of bouncyness, reduced body roll/sway when cornering and improve road gripping as well! What a good absorber that I wish Avanza come with this by default. I would say current combination is the best compare to first 3 combination that I tested before. Be it loaded with 1-7 adults. It gave you comfort and handling as well. It wasn't as perfect to my expectation if you ask me, but if Avanza come with this kind of comfort level then I wouldn't spend much in modifying the suspension system. I do feel that it won't reach the comfort level that I want even with 5 adults driving at highspeed in NSE, but It should help to gain back at least 50% of the comfort in highspeed, but yet to test that with my family. Bear in mind that Avanza is one of the lightest MPV that could carry 7 adults legally. For the height and weight that it has, I don't think we could get the comfort level as those heavy MPV like Estima, Picnic, Wish or Innova. To certain level, we have to bear this in mind. Next to go, 1. Test with KYB Ultra rear + Original Spring (Without MB Pad) 2. KYB Ultra Front set, really out of budget now, awaiting for 2nd GP user review before move on. |
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| thomasllp62 | May 29 2006, 07:41 PM Post #14 |
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FOrUM
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Check on the force use to depress the original and the Gab abs that i have with a weighing machine. The ori needs 13 kg of force to depress ,the Gab 20 kg and the KYB Ultra SP8439 16 kg just what we were wishing for. The travel time from fully depressed to maximum is a surprise 7 seconds for GAB and 11.5 sec.for ori. KYB ultra, 8.5 sec. Notice the minimum length of the Kyb Ultra abs is only 315mm (ori 335mm) which will be suitable for those with lowered springs. My one day 200km ( from Klang to Bentong and back)test of the Kyb with Mb pads , rear suspension problems for me already solved, no new sounds so far! today remove the MB pads to test without it. Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image Posted Image |
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| sky | May 29 2006, 11:15 PM Post #15 |
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QUaLITY SINsIE
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The suspension world belongs to two ends, one is soft (bouncy) and another is hard (bumpy/stiff). The original setup is too much to the end of soft and some setup like BMW spring + KYB ultra will bring you near to the end of hard. If you carry on to fetch your colleague in 6-7 person like what I did, you should feel softer within 4 days time. I felt mine getting stablilize after 5 days of usage till now. I think it will stay there till next week but yet to confirm. By removing the MB pad should reduce the stiffness and bring you more comfort as Cikgu Ken8368 mentioned earlier, I do believe that but yet to try after my KYB Ultra run-in after 2 weeks. But then, it could gain back a little bouncy which should be acceptable. Yet to try... For people living in City with less kampong road, KYB Ultra with BMW spring or KYB Ultra with MB Pad + Stock Spring would be good even it's a little stiffer sometime. I would prefer a little softer too since I drove among small town road most of the time. This morning, I drove along Senai to JB via Skudai highway alone and the result is just perfect :thumbup. If you try Original Abs with BMW spring to run on uneven road, you will know how stiff/bumpy it could be and what actually hitting your butts mean. :o Our current setup wasn't that bumpy/stiff at all compare to that. Thanks to KYB Ultra for holding it nicely compare to original absorber. KYB Ultra helps to hold the 'downward' movement but the original spring with MB pad still push up or lift up our car when run on uneven road, I hope removing MB pad could help to improve this area. Even if it's not, I could still live with that. No matter how, KYB Ultra is still the best and affordable standalone solution to address Avanza bouncyness issue, be it match with any softer or harder spring or even the original spring. This little fat yellow guy just work better! |
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| sgoldavanza | Jun 1 2006, 05:46 PM Post #16 |
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SINsIE
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Suspension system determines the ride and handling characteristics of vehicle. 2 main components determine the ride of the vehicle are the springs and the absorbers. From observation, our Avanza pitches too much over small road imperfections because of the spring design with progressive spring constant AND the insufficient damping of the original shock absorbers (oil type). Case 1 In spring of uniform spring coil diameter, wire diameter and pitch (distance between coils), we get same spring constant K throughout the compression. Uniform compression throughout full length of spring ( Eg. Innova rear springs) Posted Image Case 2 In spring of uniform spring coil diameter, wire diameter but different pitch, we get different spring constant k1, k2 k3 throughout the compression. K1 section will be compressed first followed by k2 ,k3 etc. Posted Image Case 3 In spring with different spring wire diameter and same coil diameter and pitch, we get different spring constant k1, k2, k3 throughout the compression. K1 section will be compressed first followed by k2 ,k3 etc. Posted Image Case 4 There are other combinations such as different coil diameter, different wire diameter, different pitch… Different constant k1, k2 , k3, k4…kn K1 section will be compressed first followed by k2 ,k3, k4 etc. Our Avanza spring is like this. Posted Image Posted Image It is the small coil / wire diameter top-most and bottom-most sections of the spring giving the soft and supposedly comfortable ride under light load. However, our “bounciness” problem is due to the absorber giving insufficient damping during the compression and especially the rebound strokes. Too many oscillations of small amplitudes are felt at the rear end of car resulting in pitching movement of Avanza while in motion. This is obvious if we follow behind an Avanza and we can see that rear end of car and even the rear axle and suspension system are bouncing up and down more than similar vehicles. We can have 3 simple representations of how absorbers should work: Under-damped----the vehicle / mass will oscillate more than desired, movement is unsettled. Over-damped ---- the vehicle / mass will not oscillate, movement is too abrupt. Critically damped---- the vehicle will oscillate slightly giving the supple movement feeling. Better feeling can be achieved if the suspension system has longer travel. When Cikgu Ken introduced the MB pads, the top-most end of spring is cushioned by the MB pad and we could get a firmer feeling as the small oscillations have been cut out tremendously. We get less of the pitching at the rear end of the vehicle. And now we have KYB Ultra ( oil and gas ) with higher compression and rebound rates compared to the original, the gas in the absorber will provide fast rebound and virtually no small oscillations of vehicle / mass after the 1st rebound and we should get better ride comfort. Just my 2 cents. |
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| honestman | Jun 2 2006, 09:06 PM Post #17 |
Honest Senior Member
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Wah Ha Ha Ha ha !!!! :lol: Wah Ha Ha Ha ha !!!! :lol: I finally removed the MP Pad and just the Ori spring and KYB Ultra. The feeling is ..........SOOOOOOOOOO Smooth !!!!!!! :iloveu2 :iloveu2 :iloveu2 :iloveu2 :iloveu2 The hard impact to my stomach and butt all gone, the bounciness is softer (not really 100% gone, bot the little bounciness just nice to softhen the impact ). Body rolling very little !!!! Definately the best best best combination !!!! :thumbup :thumbup :thumbup To celebrate this, I install a set of tweeter (rm145) !!! :wacko: :wacko: This trip to Tiara Resort will be very very comfortable!!! (Bro David, strongly recommend you to remove the MP Pad before you go for Vacation) !!! |
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| sky | Jun 4 2006, 02:09 PM Post #18 |
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QUaLITY SINsIE
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My personal comments for sharing purpose only. Managed to removed MP Pad yesterday and drove with KYB Ultra and Original spring only, felt too soft and gain back some bouncy + roll/sway at rear is noticeable again. I'm reffering to roll/sway during cornering at 30-40km/h at traffic light, My wife felt the same too and prefer to have the MB Pad install. We have same kind of butt as Bro Alvin. :wacko: Before that, I decided to give it a try with KYB Ultra + BMW E36 320 spring. Fitted this morning and yet to confirm it performance. Felt similar to MB Pad with Original Spring, but yet to feel how hard it is and full load on the coming weekdays. KYB Ultra + E36 spring give the same gap between front and rear, still look good at idle stage, not sure after loaded with 6-7 adults. Decided to spray KYB Ultra with BLACK so that it doesn't looks odd from rear or side. Bro Lineguard join me too. There where 2 sets of KYB Ultra in BLACK on the road now. :thumbup |
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| sky | Jun 12 2006, 03:22 PM Post #19 |
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QUaLITY SINsIE
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Been using KYB Ultra with BMW Spring for a week. I have to admit that I'm pretty impress with this setup and it's better than the other two combination that I tested before in terms of bouncyness and body roll/sway reduced. My advice for those who going to try KYB Ultra with different combination or yet to decide which setup to go; 1. KYB Ultra with Original Spring 2. KYB Ultra with Original Spring + MB Pad 3. KYB Ultra with E36 Spring If you are not satisfied with 1st setup, want a stiffer and further reduce bouncy and roll/sway, go for 2nd setup. 3rd setup is more suitable for those who carry less than 5 adults usually. It can handle 7 adults as well if you don't run on pretty bad uneven road that often. It is fine to me if you don't fetch more than 5 adults than often. But still I decided to go back to setup no 2 yesterday. The reason is setup 3 is bad when run over small pot holdes and short sharp hump in some Taman area. (Those illegal hump made by residents of the area). You could really felt the stiffness on your butt when run over the pot holes and bad road surface, unlike 2nd setup which is softer and more comfort. If not because of rear axle broken case in Indon, I will seriously consider to use this 3rd setup permanently. My wife doesn't accept with 3rd setup, anyway, since she seat at 2nd roll more than I do. :iloveu Btw, 3rd setup gave you a more 'sedan' fell after the spring wear in in a couple day. 3 days for my case. But I saw a cutted line on the top and bottom of spring rubber holder. The cutted position is definatelly a results of the cutted E36 springs. :o For those utilise this 3rd setup with original spring in front, please remember to reduce your headlight beam as well, because the rear is about 1.5 fingers lower than original setup. It's about 0.5 finger lower than original front setup when idle. But since the door lining is in a upward direction in design, it's still looks good when idle. Sitting 5 or 7 adults made the rear left with 2 fingers gap only. It can touch rubber stopper within 1-1.5" :o Again, above is personal experience to share with you all. I will go for 3rd setup if UMWT change our rear axle to rigid one. :nono :thumbdown :boo |
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